Charles Ives - Revision history

Spider of Destiny: /* Frank Zappa and Charles Ives */

2026-05-28T19:23:09Z

Frank Zappa and Charles Ives

Spider of Destiny at 18:52, 25 May 2026

2026-05-25T18:52:23Z

Jason.Kreitzer at 22:27, 17 November 2025

2025-11-17T22:27:26Z

Duncan at 13:48, 2 November 2021

2021-11-02T13:48:12Z

Jason.Kreitzer at 13:39, 6 October 2021

2021-10-06T13:39:50Z

Spider of Destiny at 10:37, 25 August 2014

2014-08-25T10:37:36Z

Duncan: Moved external files

2008-04-02T18:40:36Z

Moved external files

Emdebe at 20:40, 20 September 2005

2005-09-20T20:40:38Z

Duncan: Work in progress: To be Zappafied

2005-08-27T08:24:22Z

Work in progress: To be Zappafied

Duncan at 07:53, 27 August 2005

2005-08-27T07:53:26Z

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 Frank Zappa included Charles Ives in the list of names on the ''[[Freak Out!]]'' cover, under the heading: ''These People Have Contributed Materially in Many Ways to Make Our Music What it is. Please Do Not Hold it Against Them.''
 In 1969 he composed a track titled after Ives, ''[[Charles Ives (The Track)]]''. Its drum track can be heard during ''[[The Blimp]]'' on [[Captain Beefheart]]'s ''[[Trout Mask Replica]]''. The full track was only released in full on ''[[You Can't Do That On Stage Anymore Vol. 5]]'', while the drumtrack was also added as part of ''[[Didja Get Any Onya?]]'' on the CD re-release of ''[[Weasels Ripped My Flesh]]''.
 ==Frank Zappa about Charles Ives==

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-[[File:Charlesives.jpg|thumb|right]]
+[[File:Charlesives.jpg|thumb|right|Charles Ives]]
-'''Charles Edward Ives''' (Born: October 20, 1874. Danbury, CT. Died: May 19, 1954. New York, NY) was an American modernist composer.
+==Biography==
-<blockquote>Beauty in music is too often confused with something that lets the ear lie back in an easy chair. Many sounds that we are used to do not bother us, and for that reason we are inclined to call them beautiful. Frequently -- possibly almost invariably -- analytical and impersonal test will show that when a new or unfamiliar work is accepted as beautiful on its first hearing, its fundamental quality is one that tends to put the mind to sleep.</blockquote><div align=right>attributed to Charles Ives but source unknown</div>
+Following a serious heart attack in 1918, Ives' health and productivity declined; his last new pieces date from the mid-1920s. He lived his last decades as an invalid in New York City and West Redding, Conn., promoting his music as best he could and revising pieces.
-<blockquote>on [[Absolutely Free]], our second album. There's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable (1966 - Los Angeles)|Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "The Star-Spangled Banner," "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" all at the same time, yielding an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>
+==Frank Zappa and Charles Ives==
-An organ prodigy, he was first trained by his bandmaster father, who also instilled a penchant for musical experiment. At Yale University (1894-98) he learned much from the conservative Horatio Parker, but in view of his advanced musical ideas he decided not to pursue a career in music. After college he entered the insurance business in New York City and over the next three decades he would rise nearly to the top of that profession. At the same time, after leaving his last church-organist job in 1902, he began a perhaps unprecedented period of creative isolation for a major composer; for twenty years, in his spare time, he composed prolifically and with growing confidence and maturity, although during those years his music was rarely heard in public. His important works, all marked by a unique blend of prophetic experiment and familiar American material, include the "Concord Sonata", "Three Places in New England", the "Holidays Symphony", and the "Fourth Symphony". Following a serious heart attack in 1918, his health and productivity declined; his last new pieces date from the mid-1920s. He lived his last decades as an invalid in New York City and West Redding, Conn., promoting his music as best he could and revising pieces.
+Frank Zappa included Charles Ives in the list of names on the ''[[Freak Out!]]'' cover, under the heading: ''These People Have Contributed Materially in Many Ways to Make Our Music What it is. Please Do Not Hold it Against Them.''
-He is included in the list of names on the [[Freak Out!]] cover.
+In 1969 he composed a track titled after Ives, ''[[Charles Ives (The Track)]]''. Its drum track can be heard during ''[[The Blimp]]'' on [[Captain Beefheart]]'s ''[[Trout Mask Replica]]''. The full track was only released in full on ''[[You Can't Do That On Stage Anymore Vol. 5]]'', while the drumtrack was also added as part of ''[[Didja Get Any Onya?]]'' on the CD re-release of ''[[Weasels Ripped My Flesh]]''.
-==Streams==
+==Frank Zappa about Charles Ives==
-'''The Fourth of July from New England Holidays'''
+<blockquote>''On [[Absolutely Free]], our second album, there's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable (1966 - Los Angeles)|Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "[[The Star-Spangled Banner]]," "[[God Bless America]]" and "[[America the Beautiful]]" all at the same time, yielding an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".''</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>
 ==See also==
 [[Charles Ives (The Track)|Zappa's composition Charles Ives]]
-[[wikipedia:Charles Ives|Charles Ives - Wikipedia]]
+==External links==
 [[Category:Influences|Ives, Charles]]
 [[Category:Composers|Ives, Charles]]
 [[Category:Freak Out! (The List)|Ives, Charles]]
 [[Category:The Real Frank Zappa Book (The List)|Ives, Charles]]

← Older revision	Revision as of 22:27, 17 November 2025
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	+	[[File:Charlesives.jpg\|thumb\|right]]

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
-<blockquote>on [[Absolutely Free]], our second album. There's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable (1966 - Los Angeles)|Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "The Star-Spangled Banner," "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" all at the same time, yielding an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>
+<blockquote>Beauty in music is too often confused with something that lets the ear lie back in an easy chair. Many sounds that we are used to do not bother us, and for that reason we are inclined to call them beautiful. Frequently -- possibly almost invariably -- analytical and impersonal test will show that when a new or unfamiliar work is accepted as beautiful on its first hearing, its fundamental quality is one that tends to put the mind to sleep.</blockquote><div align=right>attributed to Charles Ives but source unknown</div>
-[[Charles Ives|Charles Edward Ives]] Born: October 20, 1874. Danbury, CT. Died: May 19, 1954. New York, NY
+==Streams==
-An organ prodigy, he was first trained by his bandmaster father, who also instilled a penchant for musical experiment. At Yale University (1894-98) he learned much from the conservative Horatio Parker, but in view of his advanced musical ideas he decided not to pursue a career in music. After college he entered the insurance business in New York City and over the next three decades he would rise nearly to the top of that profession. At the same time, after leaving his last church-organist job in 1902, he began a perhaps unprecedented period of creative isolation for a major composer; for twenty years, in his spare time, he composed prolifically and with growing confidence and maturity, although during those years his music was rarely heard in public. His important works, all marked by a unique blend of prophetic experiment and familiar American material, include the "Concord Sonata", "Three Places in New England", the "Holidays Symphony", and the "Fourth Symphony". Following a serious heart attack in 1918, his health and productivity declined; his last new pieces date from the mid-1920s. He lived his last decades as an invalid in New York City and West Redding, Conn., promoting his music as best he could and revising pieces; meanwhile, various enthusiasts gradually spread his music into the world.
+==See also==
+[[Charles Ives (The Track)|Zappa's composition Charles Ives]]
-Public Domain Text: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ZWJ/essays_before.pdf Essays Before a Sonata] (135K pdf)
+[[wikipedia:Charles Ives|Charles Ives - Wikipedia]]
 [[Category:Influences|Ives, Charles]]

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:39, 6 October 2021
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−	<blockquote>on [[Absolutely Free]], our second album. There's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "The Star-Spangled Banner," "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" all at the same time, yielding	+	<blockquote>on [[Absolutely Free]], our second album. There's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable (1966 - Los Angeles)\|Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "The Star-Spangled Banner," "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" all at the same time, yielding an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>
−	an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>

@@ Line 21: / Line 21: @@
 He is included in the list of names on the [[Freak Out!]] cover.
-Example: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ivesragtime.mp3 Ragtime Dances (No. 4)] (180K mp3 extract)
+Example: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ZWJ/ivesragtime.mp3 Ragtime Dances (No. 4)] (180K mp3 extract)
-Public Domain Text: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/essays_before.pdf Essays Before a Sonata] (135K pdf)
+Public Domain Text: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ZWJ/essays_before.pdf Essays Before a Sonata] (135K pdf)
 [[Category:Supporting Cast|Ives, Charles]]

@@ Line 6: / Line 6: @@
 <blockquote>on [[Absolutely Free]], our second album. There's a twisted reference to [[Charles Ives]] at the end of [[Call Any Vegetable]]. One of the things that Ives is noted for is his use of multiple colliding themes -- the musical illusion of several marching bands marching through each other. In our low-rent version, the band splits into three parts, playing "The Star-Spangled Banner," "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" all at the same time, yielding
 an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>
 [[Charles Ives|Charles Edward Ives]] Born: October 20, 1874. Danbury, CT. Died: May 19, 1954. New York, NY
@@ Line 19: / Line 23: @@
 Example: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ivesragtime.mp3 Ragtime Dances (No. 4)] (180K mp3 extract)
 [[Category:Supporting Cast]]

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:53, 27 August 2005
Line 7:		Line 7:
	an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>		an amateur version of an Ives collision. Unless listeners pay attention in that one spot, there are only a few bars of it, they might think it was a "mistake".</blockquote><div align=right>[[The Real Frank Zappa Book]]</div>

−	[[Charles Ives\|Charles Edward Ives]] (1874-1954) is name-checked on the cover of "Freak Out!" (1966) under the heading "These People Have Contributed Materially In Many Ways To Make Our Music What It Is. Please Do Not Hold It Against Them". He is also mentioned in "The Real Frank Zappa Book" (1989). ~~Composer born in~~ Danbury, ~~Conn~~. ~~An organ prodigy~~, he was first trained by his bandmaster father, who also instilled a penchant for musical experiment. At Yale University (1894-98) he learned much from the conservative Horatio Parker, but in view of his advanced musical ideas he decided not to pursue a career in music. After college he entered the insurance business in New York City and over the next three decades he would rise nearly to the top of that profession. At the same time, after leaving his last church-organist job in 1902, he began a perhaps unprecedented period of creative isolation for a major composer; for twenty years, in his spare time, he composed prolifically and with growing confidence and maturity, although during those years his music was rarely heard in public. His important works, all marked by a unique blend of prophetic experiment and familiar American material, include the "Concord Sonata", "Three Places in New England", the "Holidays Symphony", and the "Fourth Symphony". Following a serious heart attack in 1918, his health and productivity declined; his last new pieces date from the mid-1920s. He lived his last decades as an invalid in New York ~~City and West Redding~~, ~~Conn., promoting his music as best he could and revising pieces; meanwhile, various enthusiasts gradually spread his music into the world.~~	+	[[Charles Ives\|Charles Edward Ives]] Born: October 20, 1874. Danbury, CT. Died: May 19, 1954. New York, NY

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		+
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		+	An organ prodigy, he was first trained by his bandmaster father, who also instilled a penchant for musical experiment. At Yale University (1894-98) he learned much from the conservative Horatio Parker, but in view of his advanced musical ideas he decided not to pursue a career in music. After college he entered the insurance business in New York City and over the next three decades he would rise nearly to the top of that profession. At the same time, after leaving his last church-organist job in 1902, he began a perhaps unprecedented period of creative isolation for a major composer; for twenty years, in his spare time, he composed prolifically and with growing confidence and maturity, although during those years his music was rarely heard in public. His important works, all marked by a unique blend of prophetic experiment and familiar American material, include the "Concord Sonata", "Three Places in New England", the "Holidays Symphony", and the "Fourth Symphony". Following a serious heart attack in 1918, his health and productivity declined; his last new pieces date from the mid-1920s. He lived his last decades as an invalid in New York City and West Redding, Conn., promoting his music as best he could and revising pieces; meanwhile, various enthusiasts gradually spread his music into the world.
		+
		+
		+	He is included in the list of names on the [[Freak Out!]] cover.
		+
		+	Example: [http://www.duncanmoran.me.uk/ivesragtime.mp3 Ragtime Dances (No. 4)] (180K mp3 extract)